Against nincsnevem

 A response to an interlocutor at Edgar Foster's blog 

Timestamp 6:27 A.M

@nincsnevem Next:our hope

You claimed"Ephesians 4:4 easily disproves the two-class salvation invented by Rutherford in 1935, since there is only "one hope".

Ephesians ch.4:4-6ESV"There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call— 5one Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all. "

Of course there is nothing in this verse that proves or disproves an earthly paradise for the vast majority of humanity. It's not the location or the surroundings that make a paradise it's the company joyful fellowship with JEHOVAH and his saints.

After all sin began in heaven

Paul says that those he was writing were CALLED to a single hope by whom by the one Lord i.e the Risen Christ those who live and died prior to Christ ascension certainly can't respond to this call because they are incapable of hearing.

Those who passed on without a witness can't hear this call

Romans ch.10:14NIV"How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them?"

Of course if there was some kind of post mortem evangel to departed spirits none of this would be an issue. Spirit beings would not need faith they would see these spiritual realities first hand.

But Paul's urgency suggest that if the living aren't reached in this life with the gospel and if they don't put faith in it. They have no share in these promises i.e heaven.

Paul says that those he was writing were CALLED to a single hope by whom by the one Lord i.e the Risen Christ those who live and died prior to Christ ascension certainly can't respond to this call because they are incapable of hearing.

Those who passed on without a witness can't hear this call

Romans ch.10:14NIV"How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them?"

Of course if there was some kind of post mortem evangel to departed spirits none of this would be an issue. Spirit beings would not need faith they would see these spiritual realities first hand.

But Paul's urgency suggest that if the living aren't reached in this life with the gospel and if they don't put faith in it. They have no share in these promises i.e heaven.

John ch.3:5 NIV "Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God UNLESS they are born of water(Baptism) and the Spirit."

That would appear to rule out the dead.

Luke ch.16:16NIV"“The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John. Since that time, the good news of the kingdom of God is being preached(Not to spirit beings), and everyone is forcing their way into it."

Matthew ch.11:11NIV"Truly I tell you, among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet whoever is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he. "

This is clearly not refering to anyone's present status but their prospects Jesus himself was not at that time literally in the kingdom

The ancient worthies represented by John had no prospect of a place in the heavenly paradise.

Hebrews ch.11:39,40NIV"These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised, since God had planned something BETTER for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect."So by JEHOVAH'S design the vast majority of mankind have no prospect for entry into the heavenly kingdom. This is only a conundrum for those emotionally invested in the false heaven/eternal conscious torment binary. The bible does not recognise any such binary.

Let's go back to the begining

Genesis ch.2:8,9ASV"And JEHOVAH God planted a garden eastward, in Eden; and there he put the man whom he had formed. 9And out of the ground made JEHOVAH God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the TREE OF LIFE also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil."

Note there was no tree of death in this garden so death and the death dealing were not part of JEHOVAH'S purpose for man.

The tree of life was a symbol of the permanent physical perfection man was meant to enjoy.

Genesis ch.3:22,23ASV"And JEHOVAH God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil; and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever-therefore JEHOVAH God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken. "

The restoration of the earthly paradise i.e the human perfection epitomised both Adams has always been a key component JEHOVAH'S agenda

Acts ch.3:21NIV"Heaven must receive him until the time comes for God to RESTORE everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets."

To be continued.