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Monday 21 August 2023

Against Roman

Roman: So when you say "his essence is bordered" what does that actually mean? If it does not mean that beyond his border things are more and less immanent to him and thus  does not have immediate access, then what? if he has immediate access in what sense is he "bordered."

AservantofJEHOVAH:As I've explained space is not a limiting factor to JEHOVAH he is telekinetic so despite not being immanent he does have immediate access to the entirety of his creation despite being bordered.



Romans:Telekenesis doesn't change anything I said, evenodong y people who supposedly have telekenisis know things more and less immanently, and access things more and less immanently

AservantofJEHOVAH: And how many telekinetic individuals are you aquatinted with so that you can authoritatively pronounce on the nature of JEHOVAH'S telekinesis. Because of the nature of his telekinesis JEHOVAH has immediate access to the entirety of his creation despite not being immanent you are the one imposing human type limitations on JEHOVAH not me.


Romans:Also if Jehovah has immediate knowledge of anything at all times, it makes no sense to say he has a center of perception.

Why not? If there is a border between JEHOVAH'S essence and everything else the the fact that this border is not a limiting factor to his access to the creation does not make it go away.


Romans:The Holy spirit is just God in his action, it's not a separate thing.


1 Kings 8:27 doesn't imply that at all, it implies that no space can contain God because God is transcendent.

Heavens and earth refer to the creation. There is a border between the creation and its creator that cannot be breached in either direction. The spirit is a projection of JEHOVAH'S Actualised potential so I agree with you in a sense. But the spirit's effect is immediate so one can say that JEHOVAH is virtually immanent despite not being literally immanent.


Romans:1 Kings 8:39 There is no reason to take "heavens" in this regard to be a literally place (anymore than he literally hears, or literally has arms), it refers to God in his transcendence, i.e. beyond our immanent phenomenological world.

  AservantofJEHOVAH: Taken as whole the statements imply that there is a border between JEHOVAH and his creation but possessing telekinetic capabilities that give him immediate access to his creation he can immediately assess and affect his entire creation. Like I said most of these objections involve a projecting of human type insecurities upon JEHOVAH.


Romans:To say that there exists some uncreated "space" is to deny what the bible says clearly, that all things are created by God, also if God existed alone prior to creation there being "space" is nonsense, space between him and what?

AservantofJEHOVAH:Infinity Roman space and time are abstractions like numbers, colours abstractions can neither be created nor destroyed only instantiated.


Romans:If Jehovah exists "in" some "space" and is bounded, and can only act through some substance that is distinct from him called (holy spirit), then he is not self-sufficient but nor is he self-existent, but he is continent and dependent like other creatures.

AservantofJEHOVAH: No because the holy spirit is his Actualised potential and hence not a supplement to his power so he remains self sufficient in that all the information and energy manifest in his work came out of him and is not supplemented because he is telekinetic he can instantly actualise this potential at any place and time beyond the border of his essence.


Romans:Also what do you mean when you say he has a "form?" like a shape? Does he have a front and back? I mean are you seeing the problem here?

AservantofJEHOVAH:Do you believe that the holy angels have a front or a back or an up or a down. I seem to remember specifying that his form is unlike anything in the creation and that we ought not to imagine that it would be humanoid. So no his form is not humanoid. Does not consists of specialised parts and so has no front/back/left/right/up/down. Just like the bodies the angels have and the anointed expect to receive.

1Johh ch.3:2"Beloved, we are God’s children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is."

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