Brother Rutherford's opening salvo of the Rutherford Troy debate.
HERE IS RUTHERFORD'S OPENING ARGUMENT.
Mr. Rutherford said:
"Mr. Chairman, I am glad to see you in such a happy mood. And that is the result of having a
happy chairman. We chose our good friend here because he has a happy vein. I hope we will all
keep up this good period of happiness and kind feeling towards each other as we progress
through this discussion.
"Preliminary to the discussion of the proposition read, it is due to you and to my opponent for
me to say that I did not seek this debate, nor did I run away from it when it came to me. I am
quite certain that my opponent did not seek it. I think some of our friends arranged it. I am not
here for the purpose of seeking notoriety or advertisement. I am not here for the purpose of
seeking money, because I do not expect to receive any. You know, we are not going to take up
any collection.
"I am not here for the purpose of getting some one to join something, because I have joined
nothing myself.
"I believe the time in man's history has been reached when the Bible is due to be understood,
and may be understood by those who seek knowledge in God's appointed way. Therefore, my
sole purpose here is to induce others to study more carefully the Bible, believing, as I do, that it
solves all the questions that are perplexing to honest-hearted men. I hope this debate may result
beneficially to those who attend. It will so result to everyone who, with open and unbiased
mind, honestly seeks the truth.
"In these four debates, I purpose, by God's grace, to point out that Jehovah has a great plan
which he is working out in an orderly way; that the Bible discloses this plan, and that the
consecrated child of God can grasp and understand it if he applies his mind and heart to the
study thereof; that this plan, when worked out, will result in great blessings to everyone of the
human race who loves right and hates wrong. In this hour of great distress and sorrow upon the
peoples and nations of the earth, God's plan, as set forth in the Bible, is the balm that will
soothe and comfort every sorrowful and penitent heart, hence the importance to all to
understand it. To aid men in reaching an understanding of his plan as set forth in the Bible, is
my desire. I have no selfish purpose to accomplish. I care not whether a man be a Catholic or
Protestant, Jew or Gentile, bond or free, if I can be of any aid to him, or turn his mind to an
investigation of these great truths, then I shall be glad.
"By reference to our agreement, it is observed that my opponent and myself have limited
ourselves to the Bible as authority upon the questions we shall here discuss. I am glad this is
true. The Bible is God-made; other authorities are man-made.
PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing! PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.
WHO IS IMMORTAL?
"The Bible answers (1 Timothy 6:16), 'God only hath immortality.' There is a wide distinction
between man in general and one who has become a real Christian. One line of Scriptures
applies to men in general, and another and different line of Scriptures applies to the real
followers of Christ. Mark my opponent's argument and see if he rightly divides the word of
truth and makes this distinction.
"The New Testament speaks of immortality as a promised reward, not an inherent quality. It is
the greatest reward that God has to bestow upon his creatures who love and serve him. To the
Christian, St. Paul says, 'Seek ye immortality.' (Romans 2:7.) A man does not seek for that
which he already possesses. Again, 'This mortal must put on immortality.' (1 Corinthians
15:53.) If man already possessed Immortality he would not be looking forward to the future
when he would receive that which he already possesses. These Scriptures have no reference to
the world, but to Christians only. The world of mankind will never possess the quality of
immortality. To the church the promise is made, 'Be thou faithful unto death and I will give
thee the crown of life.' The highest element of life, immortality. (Revelation 2:10.)
THE DEAD UNCONSCIOUS.
"We have shown that man is a soul; that man-soul is subject to death; that it would be
impossible for a dead soul or being to be conscious while dead. Now we offer some
corroborative Scriptural proof establishing this fact beyond the question of a doubt, and we
believe to the complete satisfaction of every one who believes the Bible.
WITHOUT MEMORY.
"When a man dies, according to the Bible, he ceases to remember, nor can he give praise to
God, 'for in death there is no remembrance of thee'; 'in the grave who shall give thee thanks?'
(Psalms 6:5.) 'Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee. Shall
thy loving kindness be declared in the grave or thy faithfulness in destruction?' (Psalms 88:10,
12.) If these Scriptures be true, then the dead could not be conscious.
HERE IS RUTHERFORD'S OPENING ARGUMENT.
Mr. Rutherford said:
"Mr. Chairman, I am glad to see you in such a happy mood. And that is the result of having a
happy chairman. We chose our good friend here because he has a happy vein. I hope we will all
keep up this good period of happiness and kind feeling towards each other as we progress
through this discussion.
"Preliminary to the discussion of the proposition read, it is due to you and to my opponent for
me to say that I did not seek this debate, nor did I run away from it when it came to me. I am
quite certain that my opponent did not seek it. I think some of our friends arranged it. I am not
here for the purpose of seeking notoriety or advertisement. I am not here for the purpose of
seeking money, because I do not expect to receive any. You know, we are not going to take up
any collection.
"I am not here for the purpose of getting some one to join something, because I have joined
nothing myself.
"I believe the time in man's history has been reached when the Bible is due to be understood,
and may be understood by those who seek knowledge in God's appointed way. Therefore, my
sole purpose here is to induce others to study more carefully the Bible, believing, as I do, that it
solves all the questions that are perplexing to honest-hearted men. I hope this debate may result
beneficially to those who attend. It will so result to everyone who, with open and unbiased
mind, honestly seeks the truth.
"In these four debates, I purpose, by God's grace, to point out that Jehovah has a great plan
which he is working out in an orderly way; that the Bible discloses this plan, and that the
consecrated child of God can grasp and understand it if he applies his mind and heart to the
study thereof; that this plan, when worked out, will result in great blessings to everyone of the
human race who loves right and hates wrong. In this hour of great distress and sorrow upon the
peoples and nations of the earth, God's plan, as set forth in the Bible, is the balm that will
soothe and comfort every sorrowful and penitent heart, hence the importance to all to
understand it. To aid men in reaching an understanding of his plan as set forth in the Bible, is
my desire. I have no selfish purpose to accomplish. I care not whether a man be a Catholic or
Protestant, Jew or Gentile, bond or free, if I can be of any aid to him, or turn his mind to an
investigation of these great truths, then I shall be glad.
"By reference to our agreement, it is observed that my opponent and myself have limited
ourselves to the Bible as authority upon the questions we shall here discuss. I am glad this is
true. The Bible is God-made; other authorities are man-made.
PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing! PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.
WHO IS IMMORTAL?
"The Bible answers (1 Timothy 6:16), 'God only hath immortality.' There is a wide distinction
between man in general and one who has become a real Christian. One line of Scriptures
applies to men in general, and another and different line of Scriptures applies to the real
followers of Christ. Mark my opponent's argument and see if he rightly divides the word of
truth and makes this distinction.
"The New Testament speaks of immortality as a promised reward, not an inherent quality. It is
the greatest reward that God has to bestow upon his creatures who love and serve him. To the
Christian, St. Paul says, 'Seek ye immortality.' (Romans 2:7.) A man does not seek for that
which he already possesses. Again, 'This mortal must put on immortality.' (1 Corinthians
15:53.) If man already possessed Immortality he would not be looking forward to the future
when he would receive that which he already possesses. These Scriptures have no reference to
the world, but to Christians only. The world of mankind will never possess the quality of
immortality. To the church the promise is made, 'Be thou faithful unto death and I will give
thee the crown of life.' The highest element of life, immortality. (Revelation 2:10.)
THE DEAD UNCONSCIOUS.
"We have shown that man is a soul; that man-soul is subject to death; that it would be
impossible for a dead soul or being to be conscious while dead. Now we offer some
corroborative Scriptural proof establishing this fact beyond the question of a doubt, and we
believe to the complete satisfaction of every one who believes the Bible.
WITHOUT MEMORY.
"When a man dies, according to the Bible, he ceases to remember, nor can he give praise to
God, 'for in death there is no remembrance of thee'; 'in the grave who shall give thee thanks?'
(Psalms 6:5.) 'Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee. Shall
thy loving kindness be declared in the grave or thy faithfulness in destruction?' (Psalms 88:10,
12.) If these Scriptures be true, then the dead could not be conscious.
PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.
WHO IS IMMORTAL?
"The Bible answers (1 Timothy 6:16), 'God only hath immortality.' There is a wide distinction
between man in general and one who has become a real Christian. One line of Scriptures
applies to men in general, and another and different line of Scriptures applies to the real
followers of Christ. Mark my opponent's argument and see if he rightly divides the word of
truth and makes this distinction.
"The New Testament speaks of immortality as a promised reward, not an inherent quality. It is
the greatest reward that God has to bestow upon his creatures who love and serve him. To the
Christian, St. Paul says, 'Seek ye immortality.' (Romans 2:7.) A man does not seek for that
which he already possesses. Again, 'This mortal must put on immortality.' (1 Corinthians
15:53.) If man already possessed Immortality he would not be looking forward to the future
when he would receive that which he already possesses. These Scriptures have no reference to
the world, but to Christians only. The world of mankind will never possess the quality of
immortality. To the church the promise is made, 'Be thou faithful unto death and I will give
thee the crown of life.' The highest element of life, immortality. (Revelation 2:10.)
THE DEAD UNCONSCIOUS.
"We have shown that man is a soul; that man-soul is subject to death; that it would be
impossible for a dead soul or being to be conscious while dead. Now we offer some
corroborative Scriptural proof establishing this fact beyond the question of a doubt, and we
believe to the complete satisfaction of every one who believes the Bible.
WITHOUT MEMORY.
"When a man dies, according to the Bible, he ceases to remember, nor can he give praise to
God, 'for in death there is no remembrance of thee'; 'in the grave who shall give thee thanks?'
(Psalms 6:5.) 'Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee. Shall
thy loving kindness be declared in the grave or thy faithfulness in destruction?' (Psalms 88:10,
12.) If these Scriptures be true, then the dead could not be conscious.
SPEAK NOT.
"They also cease speaking. 'The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into
silence.' Psalms 115-17.)
NEITHER BREATHE, THINK, FEEL.
"They also stop breathing, thinking and feeling. 'Thou takest away their breath; they die and
return to the dust.' (Psalms 104:29.) 'His breath goeth forth, he returneth to the earth; in that
very day his thoughts perish.' (Psalms 146:4.) A person that cannot think and who knows
nothing could not be conscious, neither could such an one feel. As an illustration, a man goes to
the hospital to submit to a serious operation. Before the surgeon begins to use the knife he puts
his patient under the influence of an anesthetic for the express purpose of producing
unconsciousness, because he does not wish the patient to feel and thereby suffer pain of the
operation.
CEASES TO HATE.
"We must keep in mind that my opponent and myself have agreed that the Bible is the authority
by which these questions shall be settled, and mere theory and conjecture should not be
tolerated. Then let us have some more Bible proof upon the proposition. A dead man ceases to
love, ceases to hate and ceases to envy. (Ecclesiastes 9:6.)
"Furthermore, the Scriptures clearly state that he 'knows not anything.' (Ecclesiastes 9:50.) The
dead stop working; there is no more device and no more scheming. 'Whatsoever thy hand
findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor
wisdom, in the grave whither thou goest.' (Ecclesiastes 9:10.)
"I submit that when a man reaches the point where he cannot remember; cannot give thanks;
cannot speak; cannot breathe; does not think; has no feeling; neither loves, hates or envies; does
not work; and knows not anything, he must be actually and completely dead, therefore
unconscious.
PERISHED.
"To perish means to be destroyed; to be cut off; to cease to exist. -- Dr. Strong. Therefore, a
creature that has perished cannot be conscious anywhere. Does man perish when he dies? Let
the Scriptures answer. 'For he seeth that wise men die, likewise the fool and the brutish person
perish, and leave their wealth to others. Their inward thought is, that their houses shall continue
forever, and their dwelling places to all generations; they call their lands after their own names.
Nevertheless, man being in honor abideth not: he is like the beasts that perish.' (Psalms
49:10,12.)
PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.
WHO IS IMMORTAL?
"The Bible answers (1 Timothy 6:16), 'God only hath immortality.' There is a wide distinction
between man in general and one who has become a real Christian. One line of Scriptures
applies to men in general, and another and different line of Scriptures applies to the real
followers of Christ. Mark my opponent's argument and see if he rightly divides the word of
truth and makes this distinction.
"The New Testament speaks of immortality as a promised reward, not an inherent quality. It is
the greatest reward that God has to bestow upon his creatures who love and serve him. To the
Christian, St. Paul says, 'Seek ye immortality.' (Romans 2:7.) A man does not seek for that
which he already possesses. Again, 'This mortal must put on immortality.' (1 Corinthians
15:53.) If man already possessed Immortality he would not be looking forward to the future
when he would receive that which he already possesses. These Scriptures have no reference to
the world, but to Christians only. The world of mankind will never possess the quality of
immortality. To the church the promise is made, 'Be thou faithful unto death and I will give
thee the crown of life.' The highest element of life, immortality. (Revelation 2:10.)
THE DEAD UNCONSCIOUS.
"We have shown that man is a soul; that man-soul is subject to death; that it would be
impossible for a dead soul or being to be conscious while dead. Now we offer some
corroborative Scriptural proof establishing this fact beyond the question of a doubt, and we
believe to the complete satisfaction of every one who believes the Bible.
WITHOUT MEMORY.
"When a man dies, according to the Bible, he ceases to remember, nor can he give praise to
God, 'for in death there is no remembrance of thee'; 'in the grave who shall give thee thanks?'
(Psalms 6:5.) 'Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee. Shall
thy loving kindness be declared in the grave or thy faithfulness in destruction?' (Psalms 88:10,
12.) If these Scriptures be true, then the dead could not be conscious.
SPEAK NOT.
"They also cease speaking. 'The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into
silence.' Psalms 115-17.)
NEITHER BREATHE, THINK, FEEL.
"They also stop breathing, thinking and feeling. 'Thou takest away their breath; they die and
return to the dust.' (Psalms 104:29.) 'His breath goeth forth, he returneth to the earth; in that
very day his thoughts perish.' (Psalms 146:4.) A person that cannot think and who knows
nothing could not be conscious, neither could such an one feel. As an illustration, a man goes to
the hospital to submit to a serious operation. Before the surgeon begins to use the knife he puts
his patient under the influence of an anesthetic for the express purpose of producing
unconsciousness, because he does not wish the patient to feel and thereby suffer pain of the
operation.
CEASES TO HATE.
"We must keep in mind that my opponent and myself have agreed that the Bible is the authority
by which these questions shall be settled, and mere theory and conjecture should not be
tolerated. Then let us have some more Bible proof upon the proposition. A dead man ceases to
love, ceases to hate and ceases to envy. (Ecclesiastes 9:6.)
"Furthermore, the Scriptures clearly state that he 'knows not anything.' (Ecclesiastes 9:50.) The
dead stop working; there is no more device and no more scheming. 'Whatsoever thy hand
findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor
wisdom, in the grave whither thou goest.' (Ecclesiastes 9:10.)
"I submit that when a man reaches the point where he cannot remember; cannot give thanks;
cannot speak; cannot breathe; does not think; has no feeling; neither loves, hates or envies; does
not work; and knows not anything, he must be actually and completely dead, therefore
unconscious.
PERISHED.
"To perish means to be destroyed; to be cut off; to cease to exist. -- Dr. Strong. Therefore, a
creature that has perished cannot be conscious anywhere. Does man perish when he dies? Let
the Scriptures answer. 'For he seeth that wise men die, likewise the fool and the brutish person
perish, and leave their wealth to others. Their inward thought is, that their houses shall continue
forever, and their dwelling places to all generations; they call their lands after their own names.
Nevertheless, man being in honor abideth not: he is like the beasts that perish.' (Psalms
49:10,12.)
WHY MEN DIE.
"It is a principle of God's law that every perfect, righteous creature is entitled to life. It follows
that every unrighteous creature has no legal right to life. God enforced his judgment against
Adam in a gradual manner, viz -- by forcing Adam out of Eden, where the food was perfect,
and forcing him to obtain his food or sustenance from the unfinished earth, which brought forth
or produced poisonous foods. As he partook of these poisonous foods, disease was taken into
his blood and the death process began and was gradual until he was completely dead. Adam
was legally dead when driven from Eden, actually and completely dead 930 years later.
"Adam was given power, before he sinned, to transmit the spark of life, or life principle, to his
children. The judgment of God deprived him of his legal right to life and that judgment pursued
the power of reproduction; in other words, his offspring were begotten under the disability that
their father was laboring under, viz.: without legal right to life, and the Father Adam
transmitted to his offspring the same poison or disease that was in his system. The perfect man
Adam begot no children. His children he begot after he was under the sentence of death, and
therefore he transmitted to all of his offspring the disease in his own body. Consequently, by
operation of God's law, all of Adam's children inherited death and were born legally dead, or
without a legal right to life. In proof of this we read, in Psalms 51:5, 'Behold, I was shapen in
iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me'; and again (Romans 5:12). 'As by the
disobedience of one man sin entered the world, and death by sin, therefore death passed upon
all men, for all have sinned.' It follows that every man that has died, died because of the
judgment that was justly placed against Adam and which by inheritance came upon his
offspring. Every man thus justly dying would, of necessity, remain dead forever unless God
had made some provision for his redemption and resurrection.
REDEMPTION.
"In John 3:16 we read; 'For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that
whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have everlasting life.'
"I submit that these words of the Master conclusively prove that the dead are unconscious until
the awakening to the resurrection. A creature that perishes could not have consciousness, and in
this Scripture the statement is made that all would perish forever without the provision God
made for redemption through Jesus Christ.
"My opponent must concede, if he believes the Bible, that none would be saved without
believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. This Scripture is positive that all of us would perish.
"Thus we see we are not limited to the Old Testament to prove that the dead are unconscious
until the awakening to the resurrection.
PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.
WHO IS IMMORTAL?
"The Bible answers (1 Timothy 6:16), 'God only hath immortality.' There is a wide distinction
between man in general and one who has become a real Christian. One line of Scriptures
applies to men in general, and another and different line of Scriptures applies to the real
followers of Christ. Mark my opponent's argument and see if he rightly divides the word of
truth and makes this distinction.
"The New Testament speaks of immortality as a promised reward, not an inherent quality. It is
the greatest reward that God has to bestow upon his creatures who love and serve him. To the
Christian, St. Paul says, 'Seek ye immortality.' (Romans 2:7.) A man does not seek for that
which he already possesses. Again, 'This mortal must put on immortality.' (1 Corinthians
15:53.) If man already possessed Immortality he would not be looking forward to the future
when he would receive that which he already possesses. These Scriptures have no reference to
the world, but to Christians only. The world of mankind will never possess the quality of
immortality. To the church the promise is made, 'Be thou faithful unto death and I will give
thee the crown of life.' The highest element of life, immortality. (Revelation 2:10.)
THE DEAD UNCONSCIOUS.
"We have shown that man is a soul; that man-soul is subject to death; that it would be
impossible for a dead soul or being to be conscious while dead. Now we offer some
corroborative Scriptural proof establishing this fact beyond the question of a doubt, and we
believe to the complete satisfaction of every one who believes the Bible.
WITHOUT MEMORY.
"When a man dies, according to the Bible, he ceases to remember, nor can he give praise to
God, 'for in death there is no remembrance of thee'; 'in the grave who shall give thee thanks?'
(Psalms 6:5.) 'Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee. Shall
thy loving kindness be declared in the grave or thy faithfulness in destruction?' (Psalms 88:10,
12.) If these Scriptures be true, then the dead could not be conscious.
SPEAK NOT.
"They also cease speaking. 'The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into
silence.' Psalms 115-17.)
NEITHER BREATHE, THINK, FEEL.
"They also stop breathing, thinking and feeling. 'Thou takest away their breath; they die and
return to the dust.' (Psalms 104:29.) 'His breath goeth forth, he returneth to the earth; in that
very day his thoughts perish.' (Psalms 146:4.) A person that cannot think and who knows
nothing could not be conscious, neither could such an one feel. As an illustration, a man goes to
the hospital to submit to a serious operation. Before the surgeon begins to use the knife he puts
his patient under the influence of an anesthetic for the express purpose of producing
unconsciousness, because he does not wish the patient to feel and thereby suffer pain of the
operation.
CEASES TO HATE.
"We must keep in mind that my opponent and myself have agreed that the Bible is the authority
by which these questions shall be settled, and mere theory and conjecture should not be
tolerated. Then let us have some more Bible proof upon the proposition. A dead man ceases to
love, ceases to hate and ceases to envy. (Ecclesiastes 9:6.)
"Furthermore, the Scriptures clearly state that he 'knows not anything.' (Ecclesiastes 9:50.) The
dead stop working; there is no more device and no more scheming. 'Whatsoever thy hand
findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor
wisdom, in the grave whither thou goest.' (Ecclesiastes 9:10.)
"I submit that when a man reaches the point where he cannot remember; cannot give thanks;
cannot speak; cannot breathe; does not think; has no feeling; neither loves, hates or envies; does
not work; and knows not anything, he must be actually and completely dead, therefore
unconscious.
PERISHED.
"To perish means to be destroyed; to be cut off; to cease to exist. -- Dr. Strong. Therefore, a
creature that has perished cannot be conscious anywhere. Does man perish when he dies? Let
the Scriptures answer. 'For he seeth that wise men die, likewise the fool and the brutish person
perish, and leave their wealth to others. Their inward thought is, that their houses shall continue
forever, and their dwelling places to all generations; they call their lands after their own names.
Nevertheless, man being in honor abideth not: he is like the beasts that perish.' (Psalms
49:10,12.)
WHY MEN DIE.
"It is a principle of God's law that every perfect, righteous creature is entitled to life. It follows
that every unrighteous creature has no legal right to life. God enforced his judgment against
Adam in a gradual manner, viz -- by forcing Adam out of Eden, where the food was perfect,
and forcing him to obtain his food or sustenance from the unfinished earth, which brought forth
or produced poisonous foods. As he partook of these poisonous foods, disease was taken into
his blood and the death process began and was gradual until he was completely dead. Adam
was legally dead when driven from Eden, actually and completely dead 930 years later.
"Adam was given power, before he sinned, to transmit the spark of life, or life principle, to his
children. The judgment of God deprived him of his legal right to life and that judgment pursued
the power of reproduction; in other words, his offspring were begotten under the disability that
their father was laboring under, viz.: without legal right to life, and the Father Adam
transmitted to his offspring the same poison or disease that was in his system. The perfect man
Adam begot no children. His children he begot after he was under the sentence of death, and
therefore he transmitted to all of his offspring the disease in his own body. Consequently, by
operation of God's law, all of Adam's children inherited death and were born legally dead, or
without a legal right to life. In proof of this we read, in Psalms 51:5, 'Behold, I was shapen in
iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me'; and again (Romans 5:12). 'As by the
disobedience of one man sin entered the world, and death by sin, therefore death passed upon
all men, for all have sinned.' It follows that every man that has died, died because of the
judgment that was justly placed against Adam and which by inheritance came upon his
offspring. Every man thus justly dying would, of necessity, remain dead forever unless God
had made some provision for his redemption and resurrection.
REDEMPTION.
"In John 3:16 we read; 'For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that
whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have everlasting life.'
"I submit that these words of the Master conclusively prove that the dead are unconscious until
the awakening to the resurrection. A creature that perishes could not have consciousness, and in
this Scripture the statement is made that all would perish forever without the provision God
made for redemption through Jesus Christ.
"My opponent must concede, if he believes the Bible, that none would be saved without
believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. This Scripture is positive that all of us would perish.
"Thus we see we are not limited to the Old Testament to prove that the dead are unconscious
until the awakening to the resurrection.
MORE PROOF.
"St. Paul, in 1 Corinthians 15:16, 18, says: 'If the dead rise not, then Christ is not raised, and if
Christ be not raised your faith is vain, ye are yet in your sins; then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.' Mark, he says that even Christians are perished, utterly
destroyed, if there be no resurrection. They are already perished, because dead, and their future
life is absolutely dependent upon the resurrection.
"Now I ask my opponent to answer this question: If the dead are perished unless there is a
resurrection, how would it be possible for that creature to be conscious prior to the time of
being awakened to the resurrection? Resurrection really means re-creation -- bringing again to
perfect condition of life.
WHY RESURRECTION POSSIBLE?
"While we must leave for a subsequent argument a more detailed discussion of the philosophy
of the ransom sacrifice, it is necessary here to call attention to some of the cardinal points
thereof.
"The perfect man Adam sinned, and thereby forfeited all his right to life. Before his sin the
entire human race, unborn, was in his loins; that is to say, he had the power to produce the race
and in this sense the whole race had a life-standing in Adam. When he sinned all his rights
were lost, hence all of his offspring were born legally dead. The apostle emphasizes this fact
when he says; 'In Adam all die.'
"God's law provided that his judgment might be satisfied by the voluntary death of another
equal to Adam, 'a life for a life.' (Exodus 21:23.) Jesus partook of flesh and blood for the very
purpose of redeeming man. (Hebrews 2:9.) He stated (Mark 10:45) that he came to give his life
a ransom (corresponding price). By his death and resurrection from the dead the Lord provided
the ransom price for Adam and his offspring. This was an absolute guarantee that the entire
human race, in God's due time, would be released from the condemnation of death and
awakened to a resurrection. Because the penalty of sin is death and death means cessation of
life, it was necessary for the man, Christ Jesus, to die in order to redeem mankind from that
death sentence; and the fact of his death and resurrection, the apostle argues, is conclusive
proof that all the dead shall come forth.
DEATH -- SLEEP.
"Since God has made provision for the awakening of the dead to the resurrection, the Bible
frequently speaks of death as sleep. Sleep is a symbol of death, and the word is used in that
sense. A man lies down to sleep and we say he will wake again. And so we say with reference
to the dead -- 'He shall awake and come again.' As the Prophet Jeremiah beautifully states the
matter (Jeremiah 31:15-16), 'Thus sayeth the Lord, a voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation,
and bitter weeping; Rachel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children,
because they were not. Thus sayeth the Lord, refrain thy voice from weeping and thine eyes
from tears; for thy work shall be rewarded saith the Lord; and they shall come again from the
land of the enemy. Thy children shall come again to their own border." This Scripture proves
that the dead were out of existence but there was hope for a resurrection.
PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.
WHO IS IMMORTAL?
"The Bible answers (1 Timothy 6:16), 'God only hath immortality.' There is a wide distinction
between man in general and one who has become a real Christian. One line of Scriptures
applies to men in general, and another and different line of Scriptures applies to the real
followers of Christ. Mark my opponent's argument and see if he rightly divides the word of
truth and makes this distinction.
"The New Testament speaks of immortality as a promised reward, not an inherent quality. It is
the greatest reward that God has to bestow upon his creatures who love and serve him. To the
Christian, St. Paul says, 'Seek ye immortality.' (Romans 2:7.) A man does not seek for that
which he already possesses. Again, 'This mortal must put on immortality.' (1 Corinthians
15:53.) If man already possessed Immortality he would not be looking forward to the future
when he would receive that which he already possesses. These Scriptures have no reference to
the world, but to Christians only. The world of mankind will never possess the quality of
immortality. To the church the promise is made, 'Be thou faithful unto death and I will give
thee the crown of life.' The highest element of life, immortality. (Revelation 2:10.)
THE DEAD UNCONSCIOUS.
"We have shown that man is a soul; that man-soul is subject to death; that it would be
impossible for a dead soul or being to be conscious while dead. Now we offer some
corroborative Scriptural proof establishing this fact beyond the question of a doubt, and we
believe to the complete satisfaction of every one who believes the Bible.
WITHOUT MEMORY.
"When a man dies, according to the Bible, he ceases to remember, nor can he give praise to
God, 'for in death there is no remembrance of thee'; 'in the grave who shall give thee thanks?'
(Psalms 6:5.) 'Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee. Shall
thy loving kindness be declared in the grave or thy faithfulness in destruction?' (Psalms 88:10,
12.) If these Scriptures be true, then the dead could not be conscious.
SPEAK NOT.
"They also cease speaking. 'The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into
silence.' Psalms 115-17.)
NEITHER BREATHE, THINK, FEEL.
"They also stop breathing, thinking and feeling. 'Thou takest away their breath; they die and
return to the dust.' (Psalms 104:29.) 'His breath goeth forth, he returneth to the earth; in that
very day his thoughts perish.' (Psalms 146:4.) A person that cannot think and who knows
nothing could not be conscious, neither could such an one feel. As an illustration, a man goes to
the hospital to submit to a serious operation. Before the surgeon begins to use the knife he puts
his patient under the influence of an anesthetic for the express purpose of producing
unconsciousness, because he does not wish the patient to feel and thereby suffer pain of the
operation.
CEASES TO HATE.
"We must keep in mind that my opponent and myself have agreed that the Bible is the authority
by which these questions shall be settled, and mere theory and conjecture should not be
tolerated. Then let us have some more Bible proof upon the proposition. A dead man ceases to
love, ceases to hate and ceases to envy. (Ecclesiastes 9:6.)
"Furthermore, the Scriptures clearly state that he 'knows not anything.' (Ecclesiastes 9:50.) The
dead stop working; there is no more device and no more scheming. 'Whatsoever thy hand
findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor
wisdom, in the grave whither thou goest.' (Ecclesiastes 9:10.)
"I submit that when a man reaches the point where he cannot remember; cannot give thanks;
cannot speak; cannot breathe; does not think; has no feeling; neither loves, hates or envies; does
not work; and knows not anything, he must be actually and completely dead, therefore
unconscious.
PERISHED.
"To perish means to be destroyed; to be cut off; to cease to exist. -- Dr. Strong. Therefore, a
creature that has perished cannot be conscious anywhere. Does man perish when he dies? Let
the Scriptures answer. 'For he seeth that wise men die, likewise the fool and the brutish person
perish, and leave their wealth to others. Their inward thought is, that their houses shall continue
forever, and their dwelling places to all generations; they call their lands after their own names.
Nevertheless, man being in honor abideth not: he is like the beasts that perish.' (Psalms
49:10,12.)
WHY MEN DIE.
"It is a principle of God's law that every perfect, righteous creature is entitled to life. It follows
that every unrighteous creature has no legal right to life. God enforced his judgment against
Adam in a gradual manner, viz -- by forcing Adam out of Eden, where the food was perfect,
and forcing him to obtain his food or sustenance from the unfinished earth, which brought forth
or produced poisonous foods. As he partook of these poisonous foods, disease was taken into
his blood and the death process began and was gradual until he was completely dead. Adam
was legally dead when driven from Eden, actually and completely dead 930 years later.
"Adam was given power, before he sinned, to transmit the spark of life, or life principle, to his
children. The judgment of God deprived him of his legal right to life and that judgment pursued
the power of reproduction; in other words, his offspring were begotten under the disability that
their father was laboring under, viz.: without legal right to life, and the Father Adam
transmitted to his offspring the same poison or disease that was in his system. The perfect man
Adam begot no children. His children he begot after he was under the sentence of death, and
therefore he transmitted to all of his offspring the disease in his own body. Consequently, by
operation of God's law, all of Adam's children inherited death and were born legally dead, or
without a legal right to life. In proof of this we read, in Psalms 51:5, 'Behold, I was shapen in
iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me'; and again (Romans 5:12). 'As by the
disobedience of one man sin entered the world, and death by sin, therefore death passed upon
all men, for all have sinned.' It follows that every man that has died, died because of the
judgment that was justly placed against Adam and which by inheritance came upon his
offspring. Every man thus justly dying would, of necessity, remain dead forever unless God
had made some provision for his redemption and resurrection.
REDEMPTION.
"In John 3:16 we read; 'For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that
whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have everlasting life.'
"I submit that these words of the Master conclusively prove that the dead are unconscious until
the awakening to the resurrection. A creature that perishes could not have consciousness, and in
this Scripture the statement is made that all would perish forever without the provision God
made for redemption through Jesus Christ.
"My opponent must concede, if he believes the Bible, that none would be saved without
believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. This Scripture is positive that all of us would perish.
"Thus we see we are not limited to the Old Testament to prove that the dead are unconscious
until the awakening to the resurrection.
MORE PROOF.
"St. Paul, in 1 Corinthians 15:16, 18, says: 'If the dead rise not, then Christ is not raised, and if
Christ be not raised your faith is vain, ye are yet in your sins; then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.' Mark, he says that even Christians are perished, utterly
destroyed, if there be no resurrection. They are already perished, because dead, and their future
life is absolutely dependent upon the resurrection.
"Now I ask my opponent to answer this question: If the dead are perished unless there is a
resurrection, how would it be possible for that creature to be conscious prior to the time of
being awakened to the resurrection? Resurrection really means re-creation -- bringing again to
perfect condition of life.
WHY RESURRECTION POSSIBLE?
"While we must leave for a subsequent argument a more detailed discussion of the philosophy
of the ransom sacrifice, it is necessary here to call attention to some of the cardinal points
thereof.
"The perfect man Adam sinned, and thereby forfeited all his right to life. Before his sin the
entire human race, unborn, was in his loins; that is to say, he had the power to produce the race
and in this sense the whole race had a life-standing in Adam. When he sinned all his rights
were lost, hence all of his offspring were born legally dead. The apostle emphasizes this fact
when he says; 'In Adam all die.'
"God's law provided that his judgment might be satisfied by the voluntary death of another
equal to Adam, 'a life for a life.' (Exodus 21:23.) Jesus partook of flesh and blood for the very
purpose of redeeming man. (Hebrews 2:9.) He stated (Mark 10:45) that he came to give his life
a ransom (corresponding price). By his death and resurrection from the dead the Lord provided
the ransom price for Adam and his offspring. This was an absolute guarantee that the entire
human race, in God's due time, would be released from the condemnation of death and
awakened to a resurrection. Because the penalty of sin is death and death means cessation of
life, it was necessary for the man, Christ Jesus, to die in order to redeem mankind from that
death sentence; and the fact of his death and resurrection, the apostle argues, is conclusive
proof that all the dead shall come forth.
DEATH -- SLEEP.
"Since God has made provision for the awakening of the dead to the resurrection, the Bible
frequently speaks of death as sleep. Sleep is a symbol of death, and the word is used in that
sense. A man lies down to sleep and we say he will wake again. And so we say with reference
to the dead -- 'He shall awake and come again.' As the Prophet Jeremiah beautifully states the
matter (Jeremiah 31:15-16), 'Thus sayeth the Lord, a voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation,
and bitter weeping; Rachel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children,
because they were not. Thus sayeth the Lord, refrain thy voice from weeping and thine eyes
from tears; for thy work shall be rewarded saith the Lord; and they shall come again from the
land of the enemy. Thy children shall come again to their own border." This Scripture proves
that the dead were out of existence but there was hope for a resurrection.
"Both the Old and New Testaments abound with expressions referring to the dead as asleep.
We read, 1 Kings 2:10, that 'David slept with his fathers and was buried in the city of David.'
St. Peter says, 'The fathers fell asleep. (2 Peter 3:4.) St. Paul, speaking of those who had seen
Jesus in the flesh, said, 'The greater part remain until this day, but some are fallen asleep.' (1
Corinthians 15:6.) Again, 'I would not have you ignorant, brethren, concerning them that are
asleep. Them that sleep in Jesus God will bring forth by Jesus at the resurrection.' (1
Thessalonians 4:3-14.)
SLEEPING -- UNCONSCIOUS.
"Who ever heard of one sleeping soundly and being conscious at the same time? Sleep means
suspension of the voluntary exercise of the functions of the body and mind. Sleep is used as a
symbol of death. The reality is more pronounced than the symbol. If the symbol represents
unconsciousness, the reality does even more so.
"The death sleep is so absolutely a period of unconsciousness that the awakening one will have
no knowledge of the lapse of time or the transpiring of events. Now we will prove the truth of
this statement by the Lord Jesus' own testimony. In John, 11th chapter, verses 1 to 44 (John
11:1-44), we find this proof, which we paraphrase. Lazarus lived with his two sisters at
Bethany. Jesus was often entertained at this home and taught the members of the household.
Lazarus became sick. Word was sent to Jesus of Lazarus' illness, but after he heard it Jesus
remained in the same place for two days longer. He was preparing to teach mankind a great
lesson concerning the dead and how they shall be awakened out of the sleep of death. At the
end of the two days, speaking to his disciples, he said, 'Our friend Lazarus sleepeth.' His
disciples replied, 'Lord if he sleepeth he doeth well, but Jesus spake of his death, but they
thought he had spoken of taking rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, 'Lazarus is
dead.' Thomas suggested that they go to Bethany at once. Jesus and his disciples went. Arriving
at Bethany they found that Lazarus had been dead and buried for four days. Jesus here
performed a great miracle, which testified in no uncertain terms as to the condition of the dead
and proves beyond all doubt that the dead are wholly unconscious until the awakening to the
resurrection. Mark what he did! He did not call Lazarus out of heaven, nor out of purgatory, nor
a lake of fire and brimstone, but after giving thanks to God he went to the grave, which was a
cave in the hillside, and cried with a loud voice, 'Lazarus, come forth,' and the dead came forth.
"Let my opponent answer this question if he will: If Lazarus was at all conscious during the
four days that he was dead and in the grave, why is there not some proof of it some-where to be
found in the Bible? Jesus was here showing how the dead are to be awakened out of the sleep
of death. It was of the greatest importance, if Lazarus had been conscious, that some proof of
that fact might have been recorded. The fact that nothing is said about his being conscious,
taken in con-junction with numerous other Scriptures that show that the dead are wholly
unconscious, is conclusive proof that Lazarus was unconscious for four days while dead and PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.
WHO IS IMMORTAL?
"The Bible answers (1 Timothy 6:16), 'God only hath immortality.' There is a wide distinction
between man in general and one who has become a real Christian. One line of Scriptures
applies to men in general, and another and different line of Scriptures applies to the real
followers of Christ. Mark my opponent's argument and see if he rightly divides the word of
truth and makes this distinction.
"The New Testament speaks of immortality as a promised reward, not an inherent quality. It is
the greatest reward that God has to bestow upon his creatures who love and serve him. To the
Christian, St. Paul says, 'Seek ye immortality.' (Romans 2:7.) A man does not seek for that
which he already possesses. Again, 'This mortal must put on immortality.' (1 Corinthians
15:53.) If man already possessed Immortality he would not be looking forward to the future
when he would receive that which he already possesses. These Scriptures have no reference to
the world, but to Christians only. The world of mankind will never possess the quality of
immortality. To the church the promise is made, 'Be thou faithful unto death and I will give
thee the crown of life.' The highest element of life, immortality. (Revelation 2:10.)
THE DEAD UNCONSCIOUS.
"We have shown that man is a soul; that man-soul is subject to death; that it would be
impossible for a dead soul or being to be conscious while dead. Now we offer some
corroborative Scriptural proof establishing this fact beyond the question of a doubt, and we
believe to the complete satisfaction of every one who believes the Bible.
WITHOUT MEMORY.
"When a man dies, according to the Bible, he ceases to remember, nor can he give praise to
God, 'for in death there is no remembrance of thee'; 'in the grave who shall give thee thanks?'
(Psalms 6:5.) 'Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee. Shall
thy loving kindness be declared in the grave or thy faithfulness in destruction?' (Psalms 88:10,
12.) If these Scriptures be true, then the dead could not be conscious.
SPEAK NOT.
"They also cease speaking. 'The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into
silence.' Psalms 115-17.)
NEITHER BREATHE, THINK, FEEL.
"They also stop breathing, thinking and feeling. 'Thou takest away their breath; they die and
return to the dust.' (Psalms 104:29.) 'His breath goeth forth, he returneth to the earth; in that
very day his thoughts perish.' (Psalms 146:4.) A person that cannot think and who knows
nothing could not be conscious, neither could such an one feel. As an illustration, a man goes to
the hospital to submit to a serious operation. Before the surgeon begins to use the knife he puts
his patient under the influence of an anesthetic for the express purpose of producing
unconsciousness, because he does not wish the patient to feel and thereby suffer pain of the
operation.
CEASES TO HATE.
"We must keep in mind that my opponent and myself have agreed that the Bible is the authority
by which these questions shall be settled, and mere theory and conjecture should not be
tolerated. Then let us have some more Bible proof upon the proposition. A dead man ceases to
love, ceases to hate and ceases to envy. (Ecclesiastes 9:6.)
"Furthermore, the Scriptures clearly state that he 'knows not anything.' (Ecclesiastes 9:50.) The
dead stop working; there is no more device and no more scheming. 'Whatsoever thy hand
findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor
wisdom, in the grave whither thou goest.' (Ecclesiastes 9:10.)
"I submit that when a man reaches the point where he cannot remember; cannot give thanks;
cannot speak; cannot breathe; does not think; has no feeling; neither loves, hates or envies; does
not work; and knows not anything, he must be actually and completely dead, therefore
unconscious.
PERISHED.
"To perish means to be destroyed; to be cut off; to cease to exist. -- Dr. Strong. Therefore, a
creature that has perished cannot be conscious anywhere. Does man perish when he dies? Let
the Scriptures answer. 'For he seeth that wise men die, likewise the fool and the brutish person
perish, and leave their wealth to others. Their inward thought is, that their houses shall continue
forever, and their dwelling places to all generations; they call their lands after their own names.
Nevertheless, man being in honor abideth not: he is like the beasts that perish.' (Psalms
49:10,12.)
WHY MEN DIE.
"It is a principle of God's law that every perfect, righteous creature is entitled to life. It follows
that every unrighteous creature has no legal right to life. God enforced his judgment against
Adam in a gradual manner, viz -- by forcing Adam out of Eden, where the food was perfect,
and forcing him to obtain his food or sustenance from the unfinished earth, which brought forth
or produced poisonous foods. As he partook of these poisonous foods, disease was taken into
his blood and the death process began and was gradual until he was completely dead. Adam
was legally dead when driven from Eden, actually and completely dead 930 years later.
"Adam was given power, before he sinned, to transmit the spark of life, or life principle, to his
children. The judgment of God deprived him of his legal right to life and that judgment pursued
the power of reproduction; in other words, his offspring were begotten under the disability that
their father was laboring under, viz.: without legal right to life, and the Father Adam
transmitted to his offspring the same poison or disease that was in his system. The perfect man
Adam begot no children. His children he begot after he was under the sentence of death, and
therefore he transmitted to all of his offspring the disease in his own body. Consequently, by
operation of God's law, all of Adam's children inherited death and were born legally dead, or
without a legal right to life. In proof of this we read, in Psalms 51:5, 'Behold, I was shapen in
iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me'; and again (Romans 5:12). 'As by the
disobedience of one man sin entered the world, and death by sin, therefore death passed upon
all men, for all have sinned.' It follows that every man that has died, died because of the
judgment that was justly placed against Adam and which by inheritance came upon his
offspring. Every man thus justly dying would, of necessity, remain dead forever unless God
had made some provision for his redemption and resurrection.
REDEMPTION.
"In John 3:16 we read; 'For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that
whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have everlasting life.'
"I submit that these words of the Master conclusively prove that the dead are unconscious until
the awakening to the resurrection. A creature that perishes could not have consciousness, and in
this Scripture the statement is made that all would perish forever without the provision God
made for redemption through Jesus Christ.
"My opponent must concede, if he believes the Bible, that none would be saved without
believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. This Scripture is positive that all of us would perish.
"Thus we see we are not limited to the Old Testament to prove that the dead are unconscious
until the awakening to the resurrection.
MORE PROOF.
"St. Paul, in 1 Corinthians 15:16, 18, says: 'If the dead rise not, then Christ is not raised, and if
Christ be not raised your faith is vain, ye are yet in your sins; then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.' Mark, he says that even Christians are perished, utterly
destroyed, if there be no resurrection. They are already perished, because dead, and their future
life is absolutely dependent upon the resurrection.
"Now I ask my opponent to answer this question: If the dead are perished unless there is a
resurrection, how would it be possible for that creature to be conscious prior to the time of
being awakened to the resurrection? Resurrection really means re-creation -- bringing again to
perfect condition of life.
WHY RESURRECTION POSSIBLE?
"While we must leave for a subsequent argument a more detailed discussion of the philosophy
of the ransom sacrifice, it is necessary here to call attention to some of the cardinal points
thereof.
"The perfect man Adam sinned, and thereby forfeited all his right to life. Before his sin the
entire human race, unborn, was in his loins; that is to say, he had the power to produce the race
and in this sense the whole race had a life-standing in Adam. When he sinned all his rights
were lost, hence all of his offspring were born legally dead. The apostle emphasizes this fact
when he says; 'In Adam all die.'
"God's law provided that his judgment might be satisfied by the voluntary death of another
equal to Adam, 'a life for a life.' (Exodus 21:23.) Jesus partook of flesh and blood for the very
purpose of redeeming man. (Hebrews 2:9.) He stated (Mark 10:45) that he came to give his life
a ransom (corresponding price). By his death and resurrection from the dead the Lord provided
the ransom price for Adam and his offspring. This was an absolute guarantee that the entire
human race, in God's due time, would be released from the condemnation of death and
awakened to a resurrection. Because the penalty of sin is death and death means cessation of
life, it was necessary for the man, Christ Jesus, to die in order to redeem mankind from that
death sentence; and the fact of his death and resurrection, the apostle argues, is conclusive
proof that all the dead shall come forth.
DEATH -- SLEEP.
"Since God has made provision for the awakening of the dead to the resurrection, the Bible
frequently speaks of death as sleep. Sleep is a symbol of death, and the word is used in that
sense. A man lies down to sleep and we say he will wake again. And so we say with reference
to the dead -- 'He shall awake and come again.' As the Prophet Jeremiah beautifully states the
matter (Jeremiah 31:15-16), 'Thus sayeth the Lord, a voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation,
and bitter weeping; Rachel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children,
because they were not. Thus sayeth the Lord, refrain thy voice from weeping and thine eyes
from tears; for thy work shall be rewarded saith the Lord; and they shall come again from the
land of the enemy. Thy children shall come again to their own border." This Scripture proves
that the dead were out of existence but there was hope for a resurrection.
"Both the Old and New Testaments abound with expressions referring to the dead as asleep.
We read, 1 Kings 2:10, that 'David slept with his fathers and was buried in the city of David.'
St. Peter says, 'The fathers fell asleep. (2 Peter 3:4.) St. Paul, speaking of those who had seen
Jesus in the flesh, said, 'The greater part remain until this day, but some are fallen asleep.' (1
Corinthians 15:6.) Again, 'I would not have you ignorant, brethren, concerning them that are
asleep. Them that sleep in Jesus God will bring forth by Jesus at the resurrection.' (1
Thessalonians 4:3-14.)
SLEEPING -- UNCONSCIOUS.
"Who ever heard of one sleeping soundly and being conscious at the same time? Sleep means
suspension of the voluntary exercise of the functions of the body and mind. Sleep is used as a
symbol of death. The reality is more pronounced than the symbol. If the symbol represents
unconsciousness, the reality does even more so.
"The death sleep is so absolutely a period of unconsciousness that the awakening one will have
no knowledge of the lapse of time or the transpiring of events. Now we will prove the truth of
this statement by the Lord Jesus' own testimony. In John, 11th chapter, verses 1 to 44 (John
11:1-44), we find this proof, which we paraphrase. Lazarus lived with his two sisters at
Bethany. Jesus was often entertained at this home and taught the members of the household.
Lazarus became sick. Word was sent to Jesus of Lazarus' illness, but after he heard it Jesus
remained in the same place for two days longer. He was preparing to teach mankind a great
lesson concerning the dead and how they shall be awakened out of the sleep of death. At the
end of the two days, speaking to his disciples, he said, 'Our friend Lazarus sleepeth.' His
disciples replied, 'Lord if he sleepeth he doeth well, but Jesus spake of his death, but they
thought he had spoken of taking rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, 'Lazarus is
dead.' Thomas suggested that they go to Bethany at once. Jesus and his disciples went. Arriving
at Bethany they found that Lazarus had been dead and buried for four days. Jesus here
performed a great miracle, which testified in no uncertain terms as to the condition of the dead
and proves beyond all doubt that the dead are wholly unconscious until the awakening to the
resurrection. Mark what he did! He did not call Lazarus out of heaven, nor out of purgatory, nor
a lake of fire and brimstone, but after giving thanks to God he went to the grave, which was a
cave in the hillside, and cried with a loud voice, 'Lazarus, come forth,' and the dead came forth.
"Let my opponent answer this question if he will: If Lazarus was at all conscious during the
four days that he was dead and in the grave, why is there not some proof of it some-where to be
found in the Bible? Jesus was here showing how the dead are to be awakened out of the sleep
of death. It was of the greatest importance, if Lazarus had been conscious, that some proof of
that fact might have been recorded. The fact that nothing is said about his being conscious,
taken in con-junction with numerous other Scriptures that show that the dead are wholly
unconscious, is conclusive proof that Lazarus was unconscious for four days while dead and
likewise conclusive proof that all the dead are unconscious until the moment of awakening.
THE PROPOSITION.
"The proposition under discussion as stated is a clear admission that the dead are unconscious
for the reason it assumes -- that there is to be an awakening. Mark the words thereof, 'that the
dead are unconscious from the moment of death until the moment of awakening to the
resurrection of the dead.' If the dead were already conscious it follows that they would already
be awake and therefore there could be no awakening; hence, my opponent admits by the
statement of the proposition that his contention is wrong.
"Jesus points out that all the dead are to be awakened to the resurrection. (John 5:28-29.)
Awakened from where? we ask. From heaven? Purgatory? An intermediate state? Hell, fire and
brimstone, or where? Let my opponent answer, but before he answers let God's word answer,
which says, "They that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake.' (Daniel 12:2.) likewise conclusive proof that all the dead are unconscious until the moment of awakening.
WHAT IS TO BE AWAKENED.
"What, then, is to be awakened to the resurrection, the soul, body or what? My opponent will
tell you that the soul is still alive, therefore awake; hence could not be awakened. To be
consistent, he will be compelled to say that it is the body thatis to be awakened. Then we ask
him, if the soul is alive without a body and is enjoying life, and the same old body that it once
had is to be awakened, why cumber it with that body? Such a contention is wholly
unreasonable. These old bodies have given us a great deal of trouble. Most men who live to
maturity, or beyond that, have bodies that are very ugly, and I am sure it would not be a joy to
think about carrying around such a body to endless ages.
"But how absurd the proposition that it is this old body that is to be awakened! How would that
body ever be gotten together? To illustrate: A man dies and is buried. Later an orange tree is
planted upon his grave. The roots, running down into the grave, absorb all the chemical
elements of that body and these, in turn, are transmitted to the bud that forms the fruit. The fruit
matures. Some of it is fed to pigs and these are shipped away and consumed by man, other
parts of the oranges are shipped to different parts of the earth, and thus the chemical elements
of that body are scattered everywhere. The further we pursue this illustration, the more absurd
bodily resurrection seems. We are not surprised, then, that St. Paul says, in 1 Corinthians
15:35-38, 'Some men will say, how are the dead raised up and with what body to they come?
Thou fool; that which thou sowest is not quickened except it die, and that which thou sowest,
thou sowest not the body that shall be * * but God giveth it a body as it pleaseth him.' It is not
at all the body that is to be resurrected, and this is clearly shown by the words above quoted,
'God giveth it a body.' What is the 'it?' Mark you, 'it' is that which is resurrected. If my
opponent says the body is resurrected and then God gives it a body, it follows that it has two
bodies.
"When we get a clear understanding of God's plan, this Scripture is entirely clarified. God
formed man of the dust of the earth, breathed into his nostrils, and man became a living soul.
The soul was the it. In proof of that mark the words 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.'
Therefore, God made the soul the it. The soul, it dies, and St. Paul says the soul is resurrected,
and God gives it -- the soul, the being, the man, the creature -- a body as it pleaseth him. And then, in the context, he points out that some will receive spiritual bodies and others natural
bodies.
"We submit, upon the whole, that the Scriptures clearly teach that man is a soul; that the soul is
mortal, subject to God's law; that the soul means man, the creature; the soul (man, creature)
dies, and would forever remain out of existence, except that God has made provision for
redemption, awakening and resurrection, and the Scriptures with one accord conclusively prove
that the soul is unconscious from the moment of death to the moment of awakening to the
resurrection.
"Keeping clearly in mind these great truths, the debate tomorrow evening will demonstrate,
likewise clearly, that God is not a fiend, as has been charged, but a great God of love, justice,
wisdom and power.
PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.
WHO IS IMMORTAL?
"The Bible answers (1 Timothy 6:16), 'God only hath immortality.' There is a wide distinction
between man in general and one who has become a real Christian. One line of Scriptures
applies to men in general, and another and different line of Scriptures applies to the real
followers of Christ. Mark my opponent's argument and see if he rightly divides the word of
truth and makes this distinction.
"The New Testament speaks of immortality as a promised reward, not an inherent quality. It is
the greatest reward that God has to bestow upon his creatures who love and serve him. To the
Christian, St. Paul says, 'Seek ye immortality.' (Romans 2:7.) A man does not seek for that
which he already possesses. Again, 'This mortal must put on immortality.' (1 Corinthians
15:53.) If man already possessed Immortality he would not be looking forward to the future
when he would receive that which he already possesses. These Scriptures have no reference to
the world, but to Christians only. The world of mankind will never possess the quality of
immortality. To the church the promise is made, 'Be thou faithful unto death and I will give
thee the crown of life.' The highest element of life, immortality. (Revelation 2:10.)
THE DEAD UNCONSCIOUS.
"We have shown that man is a soul; that man-soul is subject to death; that it would be
impossible for a dead soul or being to be conscious while dead. Now we offer some
corroborative Scriptural proof establishing this fact beyond the question of a doubt, and we
believe to the complete satisfaction of every one who believes the Bible.
WITHOUT MEMORY.
"When a man dies, according to the Bible, he ceases to remember, nor can he give praise to
God, 'for in death there is no remembrance of thee'; 'in the grave who shall give thee thanks?'
(Psalms 6:5.) 'Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee. Shall
thy loving kindness be declared in the grave or thy faithfulness in destruction?' (Psalms 88:10,
12.) If these Scriptures be true, then the dead could not be conscious.
SPEAK NOT.
"They also cease speaking. 'The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into
silence.' Psalms 115-17.)
NEITHER BREATHE, THINK, FEEL.
"They also stop breathing, thinking and feeling. 'Thou takest away their breath; they die and
return to the dust.' (Psalms 104:29.) 'His breath goeth forth, he returneth to the earth; in that
very day his thoughts perish.' (Psalms 146:4.) A person that cannot think and who knows
nothing could not be conscious, neither could such an one feel. As an illustration, a man goes to
the hospital to submit to a serious operation. Before the surgeon begins to use the knife he puts
his patient under the influence of an anesthetic for the express purpose of producing
unconsciousness, because he does not wish the patient to feel and thereby suffer pain of the
operation.
CEASES TO HATE.
"We must keep in mind that my opponent and myself have agreed that the Bible is the authority
by which these questions shall be settled, and mere theory and conjecture should not be
tolerated. Then let us have some more Bible proof upon the proposition. A dead man ceases to
love, ceases to hate and ceases to envy. (Ecclesiastes 9:6.)
"Furthermore, the Scriptures clearly state that he 'knows not anything.' (Ecclesiastes 9:50.) The
dead stop working; there is no more device and no more scheming. 'Whatsoever thy hand
findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor
wisdom, in the grave whither thou goest.' (Ecclesiastes 9:10.)
"I submit that when a man reaches the point where he cannot remember; cannot give thanks;
cannot speak; cannot breathe; does not think; has no feeling; neither loves, hates or envies; does
not work; and knows not anything, he must be actually and completely dead, therefore
unconscious.
PERISHED.
"To perish means to be destroyed; to be cut off; to cease to exist. -- Dr. Strong. Therefore, a
creature that has perished cannot be conscious anywhere. Does man perish when he dies? Let
the Scriptures answer. 'For he seeth that wise men die, likewise the fool and the brutish person
perish, and leave their wealth to others. Their inward thought is, that their houses shall continue
forever, and their dwelling places to all generations; they call their lands after their own names.
Nevertheless, man being in honor abideth not: he is like the beasts that perish.' (Psalms
49:10,12.)
WHY MEN DIE.
"It is a principle of God's law that every perfect, righteous creature is entitled to life. It follows
that every unrighteous creature has no legal right to life. God enforced his judgment against
Adam in a gradual manner, viz -- by forcing Adam out of Eden, where the food was perfect,
and forcing him to obtain his food or sustenance from the unfinished earth, which brought forth
or produced poisonous foods. As he partook of these poisonous foods, disease was taken into
his blood and the death process began and was gradual until he was completely dead. Adam
was legally dead when driven from Eden, actually and completely dead 930 years later.
"Adam was given power, before he sinned, to transmit the spark of life, or life principle, to his
children. The judgment of God deprived him of his legal right to life and that judgment pursued
the power of reproduction; in other words, his offspring were begotten under the disability that
their father was laboring under, viz.: without legal right to life, and the Father Adam
transmitted to his offspring the same poison or disease that was in his system. The perfect man
Adam begot no children. His children he begot after he was under the sentence of death, and
therefore he transmitted to all of his offspring the disease in his own body. Consequently, by
operation of God's law, all of Adam's children inherited death and were born legally dead, or
without a legal right to life. In proof of this we read, in Psalms 51:5, 'Behold, I was shapen in
iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me'; and again (Romans 5:12). 'As by the
disobedience of one man sin entered the world, and death by sin, therefore death passed upon
all men, for all have sinned.' It follows that every man that has died, died because of the
judgment that was justly placed against Adam and which by inheritance came upon his
offspring. Every man thus justly dying would, of necessity, remain dead forever unless God
had made some provision for his redemption and resurrection.
REDEMPTION.
"In John 3:16 we read; 'For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that
whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have everlasting life.'
"I submit that these words of the Master conclusively prove that the dead are unconscious until
the awakening to the resurrection. A creature that perishes could not have consciousness, and in
this Scripture the statement is made that all would perish forever without the provision God
made for redemption through Jesus Christ.
"My opponent must concede, if he believes the Bible, that none would be saved without
believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. This Scripture is positive that all of us would perish.
"Thus we see we are not limited to the Old Testament to prove that the dead are unconscious
until the awakening to the resurrection.
MORE PROOF.
"St. Paul, in 1 Corinthians 15:16, 18, says: 'If the dead rise not, then Christ is not raised, and if
Christ be not raised your faith is vain, ye are yet in your sins; then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.' Mark, he says that even Christians are perished, utterly
destroyed, if there be no resurrection. They are already perished, because dead, and their future
life is absolutely dependent upon the resurrection.
"Now I ask my opponent to answer this question: If the dead are perished unless there is a
resurrection, how would it be possible for that creature to be conscious prior to the time of
being awakened to the resurrection? Resurrection really means re-creation -- bringing again to
perfect condition of life.
WHY RESURRECTION POSSIBLE?
"While we must leave for a subsequent argument a more detailed discussion of the philosophy
of the ransom sacrifice, it is necessary here to call attention to some of the cardinal points
thereof.
"The perfect man Adam sinned, and thereby forfeited all his right to life. Before his sin the
entire human race, unborn, was in his loins; that is to say, he had the power to produce the race
and in this sense the whole race had a life-standing in Adam. When he sinned all his rights
were lost, hence all of his offspring were born legally dead. The apostle emphasizes this fact
when he says; 'In Adam all die.'
"God's law provided that his judgment might be satisfied by the voluntary death of another
equal to Adam, 'a life for a life.' (Exodus 21:23.) Jesus partook of flesh and blood for the very
purpose of redeeming man. (Hebrews 2:9.) He stated (Mark 10:45) that he came to give his life
a ransom (corresponding price). By his death and resurrection from the dead the Lord provided
the ransom price for Adam and his offspring. This was an absolute guarantee that the entire
human race, in God's due time, would be released from the condemnation of death and
awakened to a resurrection. Because the penalty of sin is death and death means cessation of
life, it was necessary for the man, Christ Jesus, to die in order to redeem mankind from that
death sentence; and the fact of his death and resurrection, the apostle argues, is conclusive
proof that all the dead shall come forth.
DEATH -- SLEEP.
"Since God has made provision for the awakening of the dead to the resurrection, the Bible
frequently speaks of death as sleep. Sleep is a symbol of death, and the word is used in that
sense. A man lies down to sleep and we say he will wake again. And so we say with reference
to the dead -- 'He shall awake and come again.' As the Prophet Jeremiah beautifully states the
matter (Jeremiah 31:15-16), 'Thus sayeth the Lord, a voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation,
and bitter weeping; Rachel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children,
because they were not. Thus sayeth the Lord, refrain thy voice from weeping and thine eyes
from tears; for thy work shall be rewarded saith the Lord; and they shall come again from the
land of the enemy. Thy children shall come again to their own border." This Scripture proves
that the dead were out of existence but there was hope for a resurrection.
"Both the Old and New Testaments abound with expressions referring to the dead as asleep.
We read, 1 Kings 2:10, that 'David slept with his fathers and was buried in the city of David.'
St. Peter says, 'The fathers fell asleep. (2 Peter 3:4.) St. Paul, speaking of those who had seen
Jesus in the flesh, said, 'The greater part remain until this day, but some are fallen asleep.' (1
Corinthians 15:6.) Again, 'I would not have you ignorant, brethren, concerning them that are
asleep. Them that sleep in Jesus God will bring forth by Jesus at the resurrection.' (1
Thessalonians 4:3-14.)
SLEEPING -- UNCONSCIOUS.
"Who ever heard of one sleeping soundly and being conscious at the same time? Sleep means
suspension of the voluntary exercise of the functions of the body and mind. Sleep is used as a
symbol of death. The reality is more pronounced than the symbol. If the symbol represents
unconsciousness, the reality does even more so.
"The death sleep is so absolutely a period of unconsciousness that the awakening one will have
no knowledge of the lapse of time or the transpiring of events. Now we will prove the truth of
this statement by the Lord Jesus' own testimony. In John, 11th chapter, verses 1 to 44 (John
11:1-44), we find this proof, which we paraphrase. Lazarus lived with his two sisters at
Bethany. Jesus was often entertained at this home and taught the members of the household.
Lazarus became sick. Word was sent to Jesus of Lazarus' illness, but after he heard it Jesus
remained in the same place for two days longer. He was preparing to teach mankind a great
lesson concerning the dead and how they shall be awakened out of the sleep of death. At the
end of the two days, speaking to his disciples, he said, 'Our friend Lazarus sleepeth.' His
disciples replied, 'Lord if he sleepeth he doeth well, but Jesus spake of his death, but they
thought he had spoken of taking rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, 'Lazarus is
dead.' Thomas suggested that they go to Bethany at once. Jesus and his disciples went. Arriving
at Bethany they found that Lazarus had been dead and buried for four days. Jesus here
performed a great miracle, which testified in no uncertain terms as to the condition of the dead
and proves beyond all doubt that the dead are wholly unconscious until the awakening to the
resurrection. Mark what he did! He did not call Lazarus out of heaven, nor out of purgatory, nor
a lake of fire and brimstone, but after giving thanks to God he went to the grave, which was a
cave in the hillside, and cried with a loud voice, 'Lazarus, come forth,' and the dead came forth.
"Let my opponent answer this question if he will: If Lazarus was at all conscious during the
four days that he was dead and in the grave, why is there not some proof of it some-where to be
found in the Bible? Jesus was here showing how the dead are to be awakened out of the sleep
of death. It was of the greatest importance, if Lazarus had been conscious, that some proof of
that fact might have been recorded. The fact that nothing is said about his being conscious,
taken in con-junction with numerous other Scriptures that show that the dead are wholly
unconscious, is conclusive proof that Lazarus was unconscious for four days while dead and
likewise conclusive proof that all the dead are unconscious until the moment of awakening.
THE PROPOSITION.
"The proposition under discussion as stated is a clear admission that the dead are unconscious
for the reason it assumes -- that there is to be an awakening. Mark the words thereof, 'that the
dead are unconscious from the moment of death until the moment of awakening to the
resurrection of the dead.' If the dead were already conscious it follows that they would already
be awake and therefore there could be no awakening; hence, my opponent admits by the
statement of the proposition that his contention is wrong.
"Jesus points out that all the dead are to be awakened to the resurrection. (John 5:28-29.)
Awakened from where? we ask. From heaven? Purgatory? An intermediate state? Hell, fire and
brimstone, or where? Let my opponent answer, but before he answers let God's word answer,
which says, "They that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake.' (Daniel 12:2.)
WHAT IS TO BE AWAKENED.
"What, then, is to be awakened to the resurrection, the soul, body or what? My opponent will
tell you that the soul is still alive, therefore awake; hence could not be awakened. To be
consistent, he will be compelled to say that it is the body thatis to be awakened. Then we ask
him, if the soul is alive without a body and is enjoying life, and the same old body that it once
had is to be awakened, why cumber it with that body? Such a contention is wholly
unreasonable. These old bodies have given us a great deal of trouble. Most men who live to
maturity, or beyond that, have bodies that are very ugly, and I am sure it would not be a joy to
think about carrying around such a body to endless ages.
"But how absurd the proposition that it is this old body that is to be awakened! How would that
body ever be gotten together? To illustrate: A man dies and is buried. Later an orange tree is
planted upon his grave. The roots, running down into the grave, absorb all the chemical
elements of that body and these, in turn, are transmitted to the bud that forms the fruit. The fruit
matures. Some of it is fed to pigs and these are shipped away and consumed by man, other
parts of the oranges are shipped to different parts of the earth, and thus the chemical elements
of that body are scattered everywhere. The further we pursue this illustration, the more absurd
bodily resurrection seems. We are not surprised, then, that St. Paul says, in 1 Corinthians
15:35-38, 'Some men will say, how are the dead raised up and with what body to they come?
Thou fool; that which thou sowest is not quickened except it die, and that which thou sowest,
thou sowest not the body that shall be * * but God giveth it a body as it pleaseth him.' It is not
at all the body that is to be resurrected, and this is clearly shown by the words above quoted,
'God giveth it a body.' What is the 'it?' Mark you, 'it' is that which is resurrected. If my
opponent says the body is resurrected and then God gives it a body, it follows that it has two
bodies.
"When we get a clear understanding of God's plan, this Scripture is entirely clarified. God
formed man of the dust of the earth, breathed into his nostrils, and man became a living soul.
The soul was the it. In proof of that mark the words 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.'
Therefore, God made the soul the it. The soul, it dies, and St. Paul says the soul is resurrected,
and God gives it -- the soul, the being, the man, the creature -- a body as it pleaseth him. And then, in the context, he points out that some will receive spiritual bodies and others natural
bodies.
"We submit, upon the whole, that the Scriptures clearly teach that man is a soul; that the soul is
mortal, subject to God's law; that the soul means man, the creature; the soul (man, creature)
dies, and would forever remain out of existence, except that God has made provision for
redemption, awakening and resurrection, and the Scriptures with one accord conclusively prove
that the soul is unconscious from the moment of death to the moment of awakening to the
resurrection.
"Keeping clearly in mind these great truths, the debate tomorrow evening will demonstrate,
likewise clearly, that God is not a fiend, as has been charged, but a great God of love, justice,
wisdom and power.
RICH MAN AND LAZARUS.
"My opponent will cite the rich man and Lazarus in proof that the dead are conscious after
death and before awakening to the resurrection. A careful examination of this text shows that it
does not sustain his theory. I am going to ask him now, when he does cite that text, to answer
this question, Is that scriptural statement to be taken literally or symbolically? Was Jesus
describing a reality that then existed, or was he giving a parable to teach some lesson? I don't
care which way he answers it, he will be in a hole. If he answers, 'It is to be taken literally,' then
you will see the utter absurdity it expresses. If he answers. 'It is a parable,' then it absolutely
disproves his position.
PROPOSITION.
"The scriptures clearly teach that the dead are unconscious between the moment of death and
the moment of awakening to the resurrection.
"This proposition I affirm, and my opponent denies the truth thereof. If this proposition is not
affirmatively true, as stated, then we must find:
"1. That man, after death, continues mentally active; that is to say -- possesses knowledge and
continues to exercise his mental functions, therefore conscious.
"2. We must find that there can be no awakening, for the reason that a conscious person must of
necessity be awake. Sleep means a temporary loss of mental control, unconsciousness, and the
opposite of sleep is to be awake and
"3. We must find that there is no actual or real death, because persons actually dead are not
conscious.
DEFINITIONS.
"The word 'Dead' is used in two senses: (a) Legal death, and (b) Actual death.
"The proposition we are here discussing is treated from the standpoint of actual death. That will
be conceded by my opponent.
"Legal death means to be utterly cut off from certain or fixed rights and privileges.
"Actual death means destitute of life, inanimate, the state in which the vital organs have ceased
to perform their functions.
"These are the definitions given by our best lexicographers -- Webster and others -- and I am
going to prove in this argument that these are the Bible definitions and therefore the correct
ones.
"To be conscious means to have or possess the faculty of knowing one's own thoughts or
mental operations; possessing knowledge.
"Unconscious means, of course, the opposite of conscious; that is to say, having no power of
mental perception, having no knowledge, not knowing or regarding anything.
"That these are the correct Bible definitions I promise to prove in this argument.
WHAT IS MAN?
"MAN is the subject of this discussion. Is man conscious or unconscious when dead? That is
the real issue joined here. Pertinent, then, is the question, What is man? Is man a divine being,
or a human being? Is he mortal, or immortal?
"My opponent will tell you that man is a composite creature of three parts -- body, spirit and
soul; that the spirit and soul mean practically the same thing; that man is begotten and born like
other animals, but at the time of conception God intervenes in some mysterious way and
implants in that body a spirit or soul; that that soul is immortal, can never die, lives on forever,
and is always conscious.
"If that condition be true it means that God is responsible for every idiot, every born criminal,
because these are begotten under conditions over which they have absolutely no control. A
child is begotten by drunken and debauched parents, and at the very moment of conception,
according to my opponent's position, God intervenes and implants in the creature just
conceived, an immortal spark. The child is born, necessarily, a depraved creature. It lives on
earth a while, dies, and must spend eternity in this miserable condition without choice or
election on its part. Such a theory is wholly unreasonable. God is not unreasonable. The
creature I have just described is imperfect. God makes nothing imperfect. 'His work is perfect'.
(Deuteronomy 32-4.) God is in no wise responsible for the life of imperfect or depraved beings.
BIBLE ANSWER.
"The Bible declares, 'Man is of the earth earthly.' He is not spiritual. (1 Corinthians 15:45-47.)
Man is a human being. He is not a spirit being. A spirit hath not flesh and bones. (Luke 24:39.)
Spirit beings have spiritual bodies. Human, or natural beings, have human or natural bodies. (1
Corinthians 15:44.) Adam the first man was not spiritual. 'That was not first which is spiritual.'
(1 Corinthians 15:46.)
"Man is the highest order of animal life, the crowning glory of God's earthly creation. He is
composed of body and breath of life, like other animals. The word 'breath' of life is some-times
spoken of as 'spirit' of life, meaning life principle, or that which animates. The uniting of the
breath of life with the body produces the soul, or being. The word 'soul' is synonymous to the
word 'being.'
"My opponent will not for one moment contend that the body of man is conscious aside from
the breath of life, nor will he contend that the breath of life is conscious. He will say that it is
the soul that is conscious after death. We desire to meet this issue squarely.
THE SOUL.
"What is the soul? The Scriptures answer: 'The Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of Tile, and man became a living soul.' (Genesis 2:7.)
"Was the dust of the earth conscious before formed into a body? No! Was the body conscious
when formed before it received the breath of life? It was not! Did the breath of life possess
consciousness? Certainly not! What, then, is conscious? We answer, the soul, or being; the
creature, the man.
"Every creature that breathes is a soul. God applied the words 'living soul' to the lower order of
animals long before the creation of man. (Genesis 1:20 and 30 - margin.) The word 'soul' is
applied to both men and beasts in Numbers 31:28. 'And levy a tribute unto the Lord of the men
of war which went out to battle; one soul of five hundred, both of the persons and of the
beeves, and of the asses, and of the sheep.' God, in his word, declares that all die alike and all
go to the same place, 'For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing
befalleth them; as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man
hath no preeminence above a beast, for all is vanity. All go unto one place; all are of the dust,
and all turn to dust again.' (Ecclesiastes 3:10, 20.)
"Can my opponent, in the face of this, deny that the ox is a soul, when the Bible says it is? Will
my opponent for one moment contend that an ox is conscious after death?
"A soul is a moving, breathing, sentient being that has senses and exercises the same. No man
has a soul, but every man is a soul. Mark the distinction between having a thing and being that
thing!
PENALTY OF THE LAW.
"God said to Adam, 'Thou shalt not eat of the fruit of the tree of knowledge, for in the day that
thou eatest thereof dying, thou shalt die.' (Genesis 2:17)-margin. If the soul is immortal, then
God did not mean what he said, because an immortal creature could not be put to death. Was
this announced penalty of the law to apply to the body only, or to the soul? My opponent will
contend that the body died and the soul continued to live, but the Bible answers (Ezekiel 18:4).
'The soul that sinneth, it shall die, and again, in Psalms 89:48, 'What man is he that liveth and
shall not see death, shall he deliver his soul from the grave?'
MAN NOT IMMORTAL.
"Man is a soul. Man dies, therefore the soul dies. There is a distinction between eternal life and
immortal life. A creature may live eternally and yet not be immortal. Immortality means that
quality of life not subject to cessation; means that the creature cannot die and God, even, has
not the power to destroy such an one. Has God power to destroy the soul? Jesus answers, 'Fear
him who is able to destroy soul and body.' (Matthew 10:28.) Can a soul that is destroyed still
have consciousness? Impossible! My opponent will not be able to produce even one Scripture
text which says, 'Man has an immortal soul.'
THE FIRST LIE.
"Jesus, who spake with authority, pointed out that Satan is the author of the theory of undieable
or immortal souls, and that this was the beginning of lies. God had definitely said to man, 'Ye shall surely die.' 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.' Satan appeared to Mother Eve and asked,
'Why do you not eat of the fruit in the midst of Eden?' to which Eve replied, 'God has said, "Ye
shall not eat thereof lest ye die,'" to which Satan rejoined, 'Ye shall surely not die.' (Genesis
3:1-5.) Here Satan told the first lie, and from it all other lies have had their birth. In proof of
this Jesus states, 'Satan was the father of lies, a liar from the beginning and abode not in the
truth.' (John 8:44.) Again, we read in the Scriptures concerning Satan, 'He is the god of this age.
The god of this age hath blinded the minds of men lest the light of the glorious gospel should
shine unto them.' (2 Corinthians 4:4.) From the day of Mother Eve's deception until now, Satan
has been blinding the minds of men to God's glorious plan by this same falsehood -- there is no
death, the dead are conscious. The theory that the dead are conscious is not supported by the
Scriptures, but is based upon Satan's false-hood and the deception he has so successfully
practiced upon the people.
WHO IS IMMORTAL?
"The Bible answers (1 Timothy 6:16), 'God only hath immortality.' There is a wide distinction
between man in general and one who has become a real Christian. One line of Scriptures
applies to men in general, and another and different line of Scriptures applies to the real
followers of Christ. Mark my opponent's argument and see if he rightly divides the word of
truth and makes this distinction.
"The New Testament speaks of immortality as a promised reward, not an inherent quality. It is
the greatest reward that God has to bestow upon his creatures who love and serve him. To the
Christian, St. Paul says, 'Seek ye immortality.' (Romans 2:7.) A man does not seek for that
which he already possesses. Again, 'This mortal must put on immortality.' (1 Corinthians
15:53.) If man already possessed Immortality he would not be looking forward to the future
when he would receive that which he already possesses. These Scriptures have no reference to
the world, but to Christians only. The world of mankind will never possess the quality of
immortality. To the church the promise is made, 'Be thou faithful unto death and I will give
thee the crown of life.' The highest element of life, immortality. (Revelation 2:10.)
THE DEAD UNCONSCIOUS.
"We have shown that man is a soul; that man-soul is subject to death; that it would be
impossible for a dead soul or being to be conscious while dead. Now we offer some
corroborative Scriptural proof establishing this fact beyond the question of a doubt, and we
believe to the complete satisfaction of every one who believes the Bible.
WITHOUT MEMORY.
"When a man dies, according to the Bible, he ceases to remember, nor can he give praise to
God, 'for in death there is no remembrance of thee'; 'in the grave who shall give thee thanks?'
(Psalms 6:5.) 'Wilt thou shew wonders to the dead? shall the dead arise and praise thee. Shall
thy loving kindness be declared in the grave or thy faithfulness in destruction?' (Psalms 88:10,
12.) If these Scriptures be true, then the dead could not be conscious.
SPEAK NOT.
"They also cease speaking. 'The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into
silence.' Psalms 115-17.)
NEITHER BREATHE, THINK, FEEL.
"They also stop breathing, thinking and feeling. 'Thou takest away their breath; they die and
return to the dust.' (Psalms 104:29.) 'His breath goeth forth, he returneth to the earth; in that
very day his thoughts perish.' (Psalms 146:4.) A person that cannot think and who knows
nothing could not be conscious, neither could such an one feel. As an illustration, a man goes to
the hospital to submit to a serious operation. Before the surgeon begins to use the knife he puts
his patient under the influence of an anesthetic for the express purpose of producing
unconsciousness, because he does not wish the patient to feel and thereby suffer pain of the
operation.
CEASES TO HATE.
"We must keep in mind that my opponent and myself have agreed that the Bible is the authority
by which these questions shall be settled, and mere theory and conjecture should not be
tolerated. Then let us have some more Bible proof upon the proposition. A dead man ceases to
love, ceases to hate and ceases to envy. (Ecclesiastes 9:6.)
"Furthermore, the Scriptures clearly state that he 'knows not anything.' (Ecclesiastes 9:50.) The
dead stop working; there is no more device and no more scheming. 'Whatsoever thy hand
findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor
wisdom, in the grave whither thou goest.' (Ecclesiastes 9:10.)
"I submit that when a man reaches the point where he cannot remember; cannot give thanks;
cannot speak; cannot breathe; does not think; has no feeling; neither loves, hates or envies; does
not work; and knows not anything, he must be actually and completely dead, therefore
unconscious.
PERISHED.
"To perish means to be destroyed; to be cut off; to cease to exist. -- Dr. Strong. Therefore, a
creature that has perished cannot be conscious anywhere. Does man perish when he dies? Let
the Scriptures answer. 'For he seeth that wise men die, likewise the fool and the brutish person
perish, and leave their wealth to others. Their inward thought is, that their houses shall continue
forever, and their dwelling places to all generations; they call their lands after their own names.
Nevertheless, man being in honor abideth not: he is like the beasts that perish.' (Psalms
49:10,12.)
WHY MEN DIE.
"It is a principle of God's law that every perfect, righteous creature is entitled to life. It follows
that every unrighteous creature has no legal right to life. God enforced his judgment against
Adam in a gradual manner, viz -- by forcing Adam out of Eden, where the food was perfect,
and forcing him to obtain his food or sustenance from the unfinished earth, which brought forth
or produced poisonous foods. As he partook of these poisonous foods, disease was taken into
his blood and the death process began and was gradual until he was completely dead. Adam
was legally dead when driven from Eden, actually and completely dead 930 years later.
"Adam was given power, before he sinned, to transmit the spark of life, or life principle, to his
children. The judgment of God deprived him of his legal right to life and that judgment pursued
the power of reproduction; in other words, his offspring were begotten under the disability that
their father was laboring under, viz.: without legal right to life, and the Father Adam
transmitted to his offspring the same poison or disease that was in his system. The perfect man
Adam begot no children. His children he begot after he was under the sentence of death, and
therefore he transmitted to all of his offspring the disease in his own body. Consequently, by
operation of God's law, all of Adam's children inherited death and were born legally dead, or
without a legal right to life. In proof of this we read, in Psalms 51:5, 'Behold, I was shapen in
iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me'; and again (Romans 5:12). 'As by the
disobedience of one man sin entered the world, and death by sin, therefore death passed upon
all men, for all have sinned.' It follows that every man that has died, died because of the
judgment that was justly placed against Adam and which by inheritance came upon his
offspring. Every man thus justly dying would, of necessity, remain dead forever unless God
had made some provision for his redemption and resurrection.
REDEMPTION.
"In John 3:16 we read; 'For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son, that
whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have everlasting life.'
"I submit that these words of the Master conclusively prove that the dead are unconscious until
the awakening to the resurrection. A creature that perishes could not have consciousness, and in
this Scripture the statement is made that all would perish forever without the provision God
made for redemption through Jesus Christ.
"My opponent must concede, if he believes the Bible, that none would be saved without
believing on the Lord Jesus Christ. This Scripture is positive that all of us would perish.
"Thus we see we are not limited to the Old Testament to prove that the dead are unconscious
until the awakening to the resurrection.
MORE PROOF.
"St. Paul, in 1 Corinthians 15:16, 18, says: 'If the dead rise not, then Christ is not raised, and if
Christ be not raised your faith is vain, ye are yet in your sins; then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.' Mark, he says that even Christians are perished, utterly
destroyed, if there be no resurrection. They are already perished, because dead, and their future
life is absolutely dependent upon the resurrection.
"Now I ask my opponent to answer this question: If the dead are perished unless there is a
resurrection, how would it be possible for that creature to be conscious prior to the time of
being awakened to the resurrection? Resurrection really means re-creation -- bringing again to
perfect condition of life.
WHY RESURRECTION POSSIBLE?
"While we must leave for a subsequent argument a more detailed discussion of the philosophy
of the ransom sacrifice, it is necessary here to call attention to some of the cardinal points
thereof.
"The perfect man Adam sinned, and thereby forfeited all his right to life. Before his sin the
entire human race, unborn, was in his loins; that is to say, he had the power to produce the race
and in this sense the whole race had a life-standing in Adam. When he sinned all his rights
were lost, hence all of his offspring were born legally dead. The apostle emphasizes this fact
when he says; 'In Adam all die.'
"God's law provided that his judgment might be satisfied by the voluntary death of another
equal to Adam, 'a life for a life.' (Exodus 21:23.) Jesus partook of flesh and blood for the very
purpose of redeeming man. (Hebrews 2:9.) He stated (Mark 10:45) that he came to give his life
a ransom (corresponding price). By his death and resurrection from the dead the Lord provided
the ransom price for Adam and his offspring. This was an absolute guarantee that the entire
human race, in God's due time, would be released from the condemnation of death and
awakened to a resurrection. Because the penalty of sin is death and death means cessation of
life, it was necessary for the man, Christ Jesus, to die in order to redeem mankind from that
death sentence; and the fact of his death and resurrection, the apostle argues, is conclusive
proof that all the dead shall come forth.
DEATH -- SLEEP.
"Since God has made provision for the awakening of the dead to the resurrection, the Bible
frequently speaks of death as sleep. Sleep is a symbol of death, and the word is used in that
sense. A man lies down to sleep and we say he will wake again. And so we say with reference
to the dead -- 'He shall awake and come again.' As the Prophet Jeremiah beautifully states the
matter (Jeremiah 31:15-16), 'Thus sayeth the Lord, a voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation,
and bitter weeping; Rachel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children,
because they were not. Thus sayeth the Lord, refrain thy voice from weeping and thine eyes
from tears; for thy work shall be rewarded saith the Lord; and they shall come again from the
land of the enemy. Thy children shall come again to their own border." This Scripture proves
that the dead were out of existence but there was hope for a resurrection.
"Both the Old and New Testaments abound with expressions referring to the dead as asleep.
We read, 1 Kings 2:10, that 'David slept with his fathers and was buried in the city of David.'
St. Peter says, 'The fathers fell asleep. (2 Peter 3:4.) St. Paul, speaking of those who had seen
Jesus in the flesh, said, 'The greater part remain until this day, but some are fallen asleep.' (1
Corinthians 15:6.) Again, 'I would not have you ignorant, brethren, concerning them that are
asleep. Them that sleep in Jesus God will bring forth by Jesus at the resurrection.' (1
Thessalonians 4:3-14.)
SLEEPING -- UNCONSCIOUS.
"Who ever heard of one sleeping soundly and being conscious at the same time? Sleep means
suspension of the voluntary exercise of the functions of the body and mind. Sleep is used as a
symbol of death. The reality is more pronounced than the symbol. If the symbol represents
unconsciousness, the reality does even more so.
"The death sleep is so absolutely a period of unconsciousness that the awakening one will have
no knowledge of the lapse of time or the transpiring of events. Now we will prove the truth of
this statement by the Lord Jesus' own testimony. In John, 11th chapter, verses 1 to 44 (John
11:1-44), we find this proof, which we paraphrase. Lazarus lived with his two sisters at
Bethany. Jesus was often entertained at this home and taught the members of the household.
Lazarus became sick. Word was sent to Jesus of Lazarus' illness, but after he heard it Jesus
remained in the same place for two days longer. He was preparing to teach mankind a great
lesson concerning the dead and how they shall be awakened out of the sleep of death. At the
end of the two days, speaking to his disciples, he said, 'Our friend Lazarus sleepeth.' His
disciples replied, 'Lord if he sleepeth he doeth well, but Jesus spake of his death, but they
thought he had spoken of taking rest in sleep. Then said Jesus unto them plainly, 'Lazarus is
dead.' Thomas suggested that they go to Bethany at once. Jesus and his disciples went. Arriving
at Bethany they found that Lazarus had been dead and buried for four days. Jesus here
performed a great miracle, which testified in no uncertain terms as to the condition of the dead
and proves beyond all doubt that the dead are wholly unconscious until the awakening to the
resurrection. Mark what he did! He did not call Lazarus out of heaven, nor out of purgatory, nor
a lake of fire and brimstone, but after giving thanks to God he went to the grave, which was a
cave in the hillside, and cried with a loud voice, 'Lazarus, come forth,' and the dead came forth.
"Let my opponent answer this question if he will: If Lazarus was at all conscious during the
four days that he was dead and in the grave, why is there not some proof of it some-where to be
found in the Bible? Jesus was here showing how the dead are to be awakened out of the sleep
of death. It was of the greatest importance, if Lazarus had been conscious, that some proof of
that fact might have been recorded. The fact that nothing is said about his being conscious,
taken in con-junction with numerous other Scriptures that show that the dead are wholly
unconscious, is conclusive proof that Lazarus was unconscious for four days while dead and
likewise conclusive proof that all the dead are unconscious until the moment of awakening.
THE PROPOSITION.
"The proposition under discussion as stated is a clear admission that the dead are unconscious
for the reason it assumes -- that there is to be an awakening. Mark the words thereof, 'that the
dead are unconscious from the moment of death until the moment of awakening to the
resurrection of the dead.' If the dead were already conscious it follows that they would already
be awake and therefore there could be no awakening; hence, my opponent admits by the
statement of the proposition that his contention is wrong.
"Jesus points out that all the dead are to be awakened to the resurrection. (John 5:28-29.)
Awakened from where? we ask. From heaven? Purgatory? An intermediate state? Hell, fire and
brimstone, or where? Let my opponent answer, but before he answers let God's word answer,
which says, "They that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake.' (Daniel 12:2.)
WHAT IS TO BE AWAKENED.
"What, then, is to be awakened to the resurrection, the soul, body or what? My opponent will
tell you that the soul is still alive, therefore awake; hence could not be awakened. To be
consistent, he will be compelled to say that it is the body thatis to be awakened. Then we ask
him, if the soul is alive without a body and is enjoying life, and the same old body that it once
had is to be awakened, why cumber it with that body? Such a contention is wholly
unreasonable. These old bodies have given us a great deal of trouble. Most men who live to
maturity, or beyond that, have bodies that are very ugly, and I am sure it would not be a joy to
think about carrying around such a body to endless ages.
"But how absurd the proposition that it is this old body that is to be awakened! How would that
body ever be gotten together? To illustrate: A man dies and is buried. Later an orange tree is
planted upon his grave. The roots, running down into the grave, absorb all the chemical
elements of that body and these, in turn, are transmitted to the bud that forms the fruit. The fruit
matures. Some of it is fed to pigs and these are shipped away and consumed by man, other
parts of the oranges are shipped to different parts of the earth, and thus the chemical elements
of that body are scattered everywhere. The further we pursue this illustration, the more absurd
bodily resurrection seems. We are not surprised, then, that St. Paul says, in 1 Corinthians
15:35-38, 'Some men will say, how are the dead raised up and with what body to they come?
Thou fool; that which thou sowest is not quickened except it die, and that which thou sowest,
thou sowest not the body that shall be * * but God giveth it a body as it pleaseth him.' It is not
at all the body that is to be resurrected, and this is clearly shown by the words above quoted,
'God giveth it a body.' What is the 'it?' Mark you, 'it' is that which is resurrected. If my
opponent says the body is resurrected and then God gives it a body, it follows that it has two
bodies.
"When we get a clear understanding of God's plan, this Scripture is entirely clarified. God
formed man of the dust of the earth, breathed into his nostrils, and man became a living soul.
The soul was the it. In proof of that mark the words 'The soul that sinneth, it shall die.'
Therefore, God made the soul the it. The soul, it dies, and St. Paul says the soul is resurrected,
and God gives it -- the soul, the being, the man, the creature -- a body as it pleaseth him. And then, in the context, he points out that some will receive spiritual bodies and others natural
bodies.
"We submit, upon the whole, that the Scriptures clearly teach that man is a soul; that the soul is
mortal, subject to God's law; that the soul means man, the creature; the soul (man, creature)
dies, and would forever remain out of existence, except that God has made provision for
redemption, awakening and resurrection, and the Scriptures with one accord conclusively prove
that the soul is unconscious from the moment of death to the moment of awakening to the
resurrection.
"Keeping clearly in mind these great truths, the debate tomorrow evening will demonstrate,
likewise clearly, that God is not a fiend, as has been charged, but a great God of love, justice,
wisdom and power.
RICH MAN AND LAZARUS.
"My opponent will cite the rich man and Lazarus in proof that the dead are conscious after
death and before awakening to the resurrection. A careful examination of this text shows that it
does not sustain his theory. I am going to ask him now, when he does cite that text, to answer
this question, Is that scriptural statement to be taken literally or symbolically? Was Jesus
describing a reality that then existed, or was he giving a parable to teach some lesson? I don't
care which way he answers it, he will be in a hole. If he answers, 'It is to be taken literally,' then
you will see the utter absurdity it expresses. If he answers. 'It is a parable,' then it absolutely
disproves his position.
MOUNT TRANSFIGURATION.
"Another text my opponent will doubtless use is that concerning Moses and Elijah on the
Mount of Transfiguration, to prove that the dead are conscious while dead. But if you will read
the context it will readily be seen that Jesus plainly states that this was a vision. Note, he said,
as they come down from the mountain, 'Tell the vision to no man until the Son of Man is risen
from the dead.' (1 Corinthians 15:20; Colossians 1:18.) Moses and Elijah are yet dead.
(Hebrews 11:39.) What really transpired on the mount is this, as the text shows, Jesus caused
these disciples to see a vision for the purpose of teaching them a lesson. Moses represented the
faithful ones of the Jewish age and who will be members of the earthly phase of Christ's
kingdom. Elijah represented the faithful ones of the Gospel age, who will be members of the
heavenly phase of Messiah's kingdom. These two phases of the kingdom I will especially set
forth in my argument on Friday evening.
MOSES AND THE RESURRECTION.
"Brother Troy will insist that Jesus taught that the dead are alive when he said, 'Now that the
dead are raised, even Moses showed at the bush, when he calleth the Lord the God of Abraham
and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob. For he is not a God of the dead, but of the living,
for all live unto Him.' (Luke 20:37-38.) But mark, Jesus' words are, 'Now that the dead are
raised up.' Moses, Abraham and the other prophets were dead at the time Jesus spoke, but since God's plan provides for their resurrection he spoke of things that are to be as though they were.
(Romans 4:17.) All live from God's standpoint, for the reason he has made provision for their
resurrection, not that they are actually alive. Death, therefore, is spoken of, as we have shown,
as sleep. The emphatic Diaglott gives this text the proper rendering and makes it plain. It says,
'But that the dead arise, even Moses has declared.' That is to say, Jesus was producing the
argument that Moses had shown that there is to be a resurrection of the dead, and that argument
was in answer to those who claimed that there was to be no resurrection.
THIEF IN PARADISE.
"My opponent would have you believe that the thief
went to heaven the very day that Jesus was crucified
upon the cross, because Jesus said, 'Verily, I say unto
you, today thou shalt be with me in Paradise.' Does my
opponent believe that the thief went to heaven before
the Lord Jesus got there? I am sure you do not. We
know that Jesus was dead for three days and after his
resurrection he stated to the women that sought to take
hold upon him, 'Touch me not, for I have not yet
ascended to my Father.' Forty days later he ascended
into haven. Where was the thief all that time? We
answer, the thief was dead, is still dead and will remain
dead until the time of the resurrection.
Paradise does not mean heaven; it means the restored
earth, the proof of which we will give in our Friday
evening argument. The reason this text is misleading is
that, when translated, the punctuation mark, the comma,
was placed after the word 'thee,' making it read, 'Verily,
I say unto thee, today thou shalt be with me in
Paradise.' The Greek language had no punctuation
marks; the translators had no authority to put this
comma where they did. Put the emphasis where it
belongs and this text reads, 'Verily, I say unto thee
today (that is to say, I am telling you now, this dark day)
Attorney J. F. Rutherford, Who Declares Dead Do Not Suffer.
thou shalt be with me in Paradise,' meaning, when I come into the kingdom and establish the
paradise, of earth.
"My opponent cites 2 Corinthians 5:6 for the purpose of showing that the dead are conscious
while not in the body of flesh. He does not properly apply this Scripture. The words are not
spoken concerning the world in general, but applied only to the faithful Christians. These, at the
time of consecration and acceptance by the Lord, are begotten to a heavenly life and thereby
become new creatures and from God's standpoint are counted dead as human beings. (1 Peter
1:3, 4; Colossians 3:3, 4.) In the latter Scriptures, St. Paul states that the new creature receives
his life at the second coming of Christ Jesus when he partakes of the first resurrection.
"Now, while living in this old body, the Christian is absent from the Lord. And after death and
until the second coming of the Lord, and therefore until the resurrection, the Christian dead are
completely out of existence except in the memory Jehovah and are spoken of as 'naked,' that is
to say, in the grave awaiting the resurrection, and therefore absent from the Lord. But St. Paul
expresses his great desire to be invested or clothed with the new spiritual body and thus be at
home, the heavenly home with Christ Jesus the Lord. He did not expect this to take place as
soon as he died, but at the second coming of Christ, he expressed himself to Timothy, saying:
'The time of departure is at hand. Henceforth there is a crown of righteousness laid up for me
which that righteous judge shall give to at that day, and not to me only, but to all who love his
appearing. (2 Timothy 4:7, 8.).
